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	<title>Comments on: EP 1.6: The Next Steps</title>
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	<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2008/01/29/ep-16-the-next-steps/</link>
	<description>A group blog about computer narrative, games, poetry, and art.</description>
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		<title>By: noah</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2008/01/29/ep-16-the-next-steps/comment-page-1/#comment-280283</link>
		<dc:creator>noah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Jun 2008 20:00:11 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Mark, I realize it&#039;s been a while since you left this comment, but it&#039;s an interesting question. I think I&#039;m using the term &quot;fiction&quot; under the influence of people like Jill Walker and Jesper Juul -- and then I&#039;ve followed them back to influences like Marie-Laure Ryan and the possible worlds crowd. The closest I come to talking about this specifically is in the &lt;i&gt;Tale-Spin&lt;/i&gt; chapter.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark, I realize it&#8217;s been a while since you left this comment, but it&#8217;s an interesting question. I think I&#8217;m using the term &#8220;fiction&#8221; under the influence of people like Jill Walker and Jesper Juul &#8212; and then I&#8217;ve followed them back to influences like Marie-Laure Ryan and the possible worlds crowd. The closest I come to talking about this specifically is in the <i>Tale-Spin</i> chapter.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark M.</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2008/01/29/ep-16-the-next-steps/comment-page-1/#comment-239741</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 05:02:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2008/01/29/ep-16-the-next-steps/#comment-239741</guid>
		<description>Noah, do you ever explain why you use &quot;fiction&quot; as your model as opposed to &quot;drama&quot; which seems to serve Andrew, Michael, and Janet Murray?  Also, fiction as opposed to story -- which seems Crawford&#039;s preferred term?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Noah, do you ever explain why you use &#8220;fiction&#8221; as your model as opposed to &#8220;drama&#8221; which seems to serve Andrew, Michael, and Janet Murray?  Also, fiction as opposed to story &#8212; which seems Crawford&#8217;s preferred term?</p>
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		<title>By: noah</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2008/01/29/ep-16-the-next-steps/comment-page-1/#comment-201428</link>
		<dc:creator>noah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Feb 2008 23:02:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2008/01/29/ep-16-the-next-steps/#comment-201428</guid>
		<description>Andrew, glad you&#039;re liking the book!

As for the upcoming examples, let me begin with a broad frame. My hope is that the concepts and approach in this book are useful for talking about a wide range of digital media. If I&#039;m right, the same book could have been written by someone who focused on examples drawn, say, from computer music. And if the book convinces people, hopefully there will be quite a few writings that build on its approach, analyzing a wide body of examples. I imagine I&#039;ll produce some of those.

But this book is really structured around the argument, taking examples in the order the argument determines, looking at a relatively small number of projects in relatively large detail. So lots of things it would have been interesting to discuss are left out. And there&#039;s almost nothing about things like installation art. The whole book is pretty much like the third chapter -- there are lots of games that are interesting in terms of fiction, but I only needed PoP:SoT and KotOR to make the points for my argument, so I didn&#039;t do more than mention any others.

Someday I&#039;d like to organize a group of people to do a sort of &lt;i&gt;Whole Earth Catalog&lt;/i&gt; of digital media, or perhaps digital fictions more specifically. We don&#039;t really have a massive, broad sourcebook of projects and ideas. The closest might be something like &lt;i&gt;Information Arts&lt;/i&gt; -- but that doesn&#039;t have quite the &quot;browsable catalog&quot; feel I&#039;d like.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Andrew, glad you&#8217;re liking the book!</p>
<p>As for the upcoming examples, let me begin with a broad frame. My hope is that the concepts and approach in this book are useful for talking about a wide range of digital media. If I&#8217;m right, the same book could have been written by someone who focused on examples drawn, say, from computer music. And if the book convinces people, hopefully there will be quite a few writings that build on its approach, analyzing a wide body of examples. I imagine I&#8217;ll produce some of those.</p>
<p>But this book is really structured around the argument, taking examples in the order the argument determines, looking at a relatively small number of projects in relatively large detail. So lots of things it would have been interesting to discuss are left out. And there&#8217;s almost nothing about things like installation art. The whole book is pretty much like the third chapter &#8212; there are lots of games that are interesting in terms of fiction, but I only needed PoP:SoT and KotOR to make the points for my argument, so I didn&#8217;t do more than mention any others.</p>
<p>Someday I&#8217;d like to organize a group of people to do a sort of <i>Whole Earth Catalog</i> of digital media, or perhaps digital fictions more specifically. We don&#8217;t really have a massive, broad sourcebook of projects and ideas. The closest might be something like <i>Information Arts</i> &#8212; but that doesn&#8217;t have quite the &#8220;browsable catalog&#8221; feel I&#8217;d like.</p>
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		<title>By: andrew</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2008/01/29/ep-16-the-next-steps/comment-page-1/#comment-201391</link>
		<dc:creator>andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Feb 2008 19:37:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2008/01/29/ep-16-the-next-steps/#comment-201391</guid>
		<description>Noah, I&#039;m enjoying your analysis, such as your point about the ways that simpler, exposed narrative structures can be beneficial to players. (I tend to only think of the ways they detract :-).

I recall from section 1.6 the topics the book will be covering overall.  I&#039;m wondering, will you also have a chance somewhere in the book to touch upon additional creative/artistic forms of expressive processing, such as interactive visual art, interactive installation, and the like?  It would be great if interactive artmaking practices could be analyzed / critiqued in the same way you are for games / stories / characters.  Though, perhaps that&#039;d make the book too fat and long to write; maybe that will be saved for a future book. :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Noah, I&#8217;m enjoying your analysis, such as your point about the ways that simpler, exposed narrative structures can be beneficial to players. (I tend to only think of the ways they detract :-).</p>
<p>I recall from section 1.6 the topics the book will be covering overall.  I&#8217;m wondering, will you also have a chance somewhere in the book to touch upon additional creative/artistic forms of expressive processing, such as interactive visual art, interactive installation, and the like?  It would be great if interactive artmaking practices could be analyzed / critiqued in the same way you are for games / stories / characters.  Though, perhaps that&#8217;d make the book too fat and long to write; maybe that will be saved for a future book. :-)</p>
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