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	<title>Comments on: Live at the IndieGamesCon (day 2)</title>
	<atom:link href="http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/</link>
	<description>A group blog about computer narrative, games, poetry, and art.</description>
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		<title>By: andrew</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/comment-page-1/#comment-74128</link>
		<dc:creator>andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Oct 2005 20:26:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/#comment-74128</guid>
		<description>BusinessWeek has a couple of articles on indie and casual games (&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.businessweek.com/innovate/content/oct2005/id20051013_044501.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;1&lt;/a&gt; &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_40/b3953044.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;2&lt;/a&gt;), and mentions the IndieGamesCon.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BusinessWeek has a couple of articles on indie and casual games (<a href="http://www.businessweek.com/innovate/content/oct2005/id20051013_044501.htm" rel="nofollow">1</a> <a href="http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_40/b3953044.htm" rel="nofollow">2</a>), and mentions the IndieGamesCon.</p>
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		<title>By: andrew</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/comment-page-1/#comment-74054</link>
		<dc:creator>andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Oct 2005 01:43:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/#comment-74054</guid>
		<description>Gamasutra has &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20051013/dillon_01.shtml&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;posted a writeup&lt;/a&gt; about the conference.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gamasutra has <a href="http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20051013/dillon_01.shtml" rel="nofollow">posted a writeup</a> about the conference.</p>
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		<title>By: andrew</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/comment-page-1/#comment-73896</link>
		<dc:creator>andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Oct 2005 21:12:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/#comment-73896</guid>
		<description>fyi, here&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.garagegames.com/news/8901&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;an announcement&lt;/a&gt; listing all the IGC 2005 Player&#039;s Choice Awards.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>fyi, here&#8217;s <a href="http://www.garagegames.com/news/8901" rel="nofollow">an announcement</a> listing all the IGC 2005 Player&#8217;s Choice Awards.</p>
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		<title>By: John W.</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/comment-page-1/#comment-73633</link>
		<dc:creator>John W.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Oct 2005 19:37:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/#comment-73633</guid>
		<description>Michael,

I think that Facade will take quite a while to spread fully, even among the gaming community.  Both the genre (interactive drama) and the game&#039;s origin as a research project represent relatively unexplored territories -- so fewer potential players will be actively tuned into these channels.  The size of the file is an unfortunate hinderance.

But I want to say that Facade is an experience that hints vividly at the potential of the genre, and that really deserves to be spread as far as possible.  In fact, I don&#039;t think there exists anything else so poised to disseminate the noble ideal of Interactive Drama.  I mean, isn&#039;t it the *first* interactive drama?

So for that reason, big congrats to both of you on the Player&#039;s Choice Award!

I can only burn so many DVDs; I only have so many friends.  I don&#039;t know how else to help this thing spread.  But it really needs to spread.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michael,</p>
<p>I think that Facade will take quite a while to spread fully, even among the gaming community.  Both the genre (interactive drama) and the game&#8217;s origin as a research project represent relatively unexplored territories &#8212; so fewer potential players will be actively tuned into these channels.  The size of the file is an unfortunate hinderance.</p>
<p>But I want to say that Facade is an experience that hints vividly at the potential of the genre, and that really deserves to be spread as far as possible.  In fact, I don&#8217;t think there exists anything else so poised to disseminate the noble ideal of Interactive Drama.  I mean, isn&#8217;t it the *first* interactive drama?</p>
<p>So for that reason, big congrats to both of you on the Player&#8217;s Choice Award!</p>
<p>I can only burn so many DVDs; I only have so many friends.  I don&#8217;t know how else to help this thing spread.  But it really needs to spread.</p>
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		<title>By: andrew</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/comment-page-1/#comment-73632</link>
		<dc:creator>andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Oct 2005 19:02:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/#comment-73632</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the congrats &#8212; Michael and I are happy to get a tip-o&#039;-the-hat from fellow indie developers.  The guy announcing the award called Facade &quot;the game that frustrated the men and intrigued the women&quot;, or something &#8212; a reference to the guys&#039; unsuccessful attempts to court Grace away from Trip.  A nice thing I did notice was players there did not express frustration with the natural language interface; I hardly heard anyone complaining about that, as gamers in general sometimes do. I suppose indie developers are more forgiving about experimental interfaces.

Ian, thanks for clarifying the ad revenue info, and nope, I didn&#039;t happen to hear people talking about GBA.  There wasn&#039;t a talk or track on handheld in particular this year.  In fact there were only a few talk-talks (much of the presentations were sort of newbie-training oriented), and the ones there were tended to be broad and informal, except for the more corporate pitch talks from Microsoft Live Arcade, and from Apple promoting Mac games (which were interesting actually).  

They mentioned that the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.casualgamesconference.com/&quot;&gt;Casual Games conference&lt;/a&gt; is more business oriented, where IndieGamesCon is more developer / community oriented.  There were about 300 attendees.

Chris Crawford was briefly there (he lives a few hours from Eugene) and thought it had a bit of the feel of the GDC when it first began way back when (Chris was a founder of the original GDC, when it was called Computer Game Developers Conference).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the congrats &mdash; Michael and I are happy to get a tip-o&#8217;-the-hat from fellow indie developers.  The guy announcing the award called Facade &#8220;the game that frustrated the men and intrigued the women&#8221;, or something &mdash; a reference to the guys&#8217; unsuccessful attempts to court Grace away from Trip.  A nice thing I did notice was players there did not express frustration with the natural language interface; I hardly heard anyone complaining about that, as gamers in general sometimes do. I suppose indie developers are more forgiving about experimental interfaces.</p>
<p>Ian, thanks for clarifying the ad revenue info, and nope, I didn&#8217;t happen to hear people talking about GBA.  There wasn&#8217;t a talk or track on handheld in particular this year.  In fact there were only a few talk-talks (much of the presentations were sort of newbie-training oriented), and the ones there were tended to be broad and informal, except for the more corporate pitch talks from Microsoft Live Arcade, and from Apple promoting Mac games (which were interesting actually).  </p>
<p>They mentioned that the <a href="http://www.casualgamesconference.com/">Casual Games conference</a> is more business oriented, where IndieGamesCon is more developer / community oriented.  There were about 300 attendees.</p>
<p>Chris Crawford was briefly there (he lives a few hours from Eugene) and thought it had a bit of the feel of the GDC when it first began way back when (Chris was a founder of the original GDC, when it was called Computer Game Developers Conference).</p>
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		<title>By: nick</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/comment-page-1/#comment-73628</link>
		<dc:creator>nick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Oct 2005 17:43:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/#comment-73628</guid>
		<description>Yes - congrats, Andrew &amp; Michael!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes &#8211; congrats, Andrew &amp; Michael!</p>
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		<title>By: michael</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/comment-page-1/#comment-73618</link>
		<dc:creator>michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Oct 2005 14:13:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/#comment-73618</guid>
		<description>Wow, the Player&#039;s Choice Award was a pleasant surprise to read here yesterday! I&#039;m surprised so few people had heard of it at IndieGameCon. I figured that the word had already spread as far as is could, at least among gamers and game developers (we still would like to get the word out to the broader, non-gamer community, but our marketing budget of $0.00 is a bit restrictive).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, the Player&#8217;s Choice Award was a pleasant surprise to read here yesterday! I&#8217;m surprised so few people had heard of it at IndieGameCon. I figured that the word had already spread as far as is could, at least among gamers and game developers (we still would like to get the word out to the broader, non-gamer community, but our marketing budget of $0.00 is a bit restrictive).</p>
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		<title>By: Mark M.</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/comment-page-1/#comment-73587</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Oct 2005 04:04:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/#comment-73587</guid>
		<description>Congratulations to you and Michael on the Player&#039;s Choice Award!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Congratulations to you and Michael on the Player&#8217;s Choice Award!</p>
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		<title>By: Ian Bogost</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/comment-page-1/#comment-73569</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian Bogost</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Oct 2005 00:15:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/#comment-73569</guid>
		<description>Andrew, I&#039;m curious if anyone discussed the GameBoy Advance. I see a note in your notes about handhelds, but I&#039;ve been more and more interested in the GBA of late. While it does still require Nintendo licensing, it&#039;s a much more accessible platform -- write your code in C/C++ using standard libraries and dev kits available for free download. However, the future of the GBA seems very uncertain to me, even with the DS and the new GBA Micro (which ROCKS, by the way).

I&#039;ve been meaning to start a thread about this over on WCG, but I thought I&#039;d ask if you heard anything about it at this event.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Andrew, I&#8217;m curious if anyone discussed the GameBoy Advance. I see a note in your notes about handhelds, but I&#8217;ve been more and more interested in the GBA of late. While it does still require Nintendo licensing, it&#8217;s a much more accessible platform &#8212; write your code in C/C++ using standard libraries and dev kits available for free download. However, the future of the GBA seems very uncertain to me, even with the DS and the new GBA Micro (which ROCKS, by the way).</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve been meaning to start a thread about this over on WCG, but I thought I&#8217;d ask if you heard anything about it at this event.</p>
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		<title>By: Ian Bogost</title>
		<link>http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/comment-page-1/#comment-73568</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian Bogost</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Oct 2005 00:13:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://grandtextauto.org/2005/10/09/live-at-the-indiegamescon-day-2/#comment-73568</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;this is first year that TV ad revenue is down — down 26% it’s getting picked up in games!&lt;/i&gt;

Lies. Or distortions at least. It&#039;s not a lie that ad revenue is down -- it is -- but that it&#039;s getting picked up in games. Rather, some &lt;i&gt;small fraction&lt;/i&gt; of that revenue is getting picked up in games. But I can tell you from a LOT of personal experience that it&#039;s not a slam dunk, that you have to know how the advertising and marketing worlds work, and that the ad world has a very complex topology which the average indie game dev doesn&#039;t understand.

The television advertising market in the US is $60 billion/year. 26% of that is nearly $7 billion, which is almost the size of the ENTIRE commercial videogame software business. The Yankee Group, a market research firm, tracked in-game ads as a $34 million business in 2004, and while they are projecting growth to $1 billion by the end of the decade, there is a grave danger that a lot of that revenue will come from ads detrimental to games. I&#039;ve written and talked about this endlessly elsewhere, and I&#039;m not going to repeat myself here.

Anyway, I had to step in and correct that massive overstatement.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>this is first year that TV ad revenue is down — down 26% it’s getting picked up in games!</i></p>
<p>Lies. Or distortions at least. It&#8217;s not a lie that ad revenue is down &#8212; it is &#8212; but that it&#8217;s getting picked up in games. Rather, some <i>small fraction</i> of that revenue is getting picked up in games. But I can tell you from a LOT of personal experience that it&#8217;s not a slam dunk, that you have to know how the advertising and marketing worlds work, and that the ad world has a very complex topology which the average indie game dev doesn&#8217;t understand.</p>
<p>The television advertising market in the US is $60 billion/year. 26% of that is nearly $7 billion, which is almost the size of the ENTIRE commercial videogame software business. The Yankee Group, a market research firm, tracked in-game ads as a $34 million business in 2004, and while they are projecting growth to $1 billion by the end of the decade, there is a grave danger that a lot of that revenue will come from ads detrimental to games. I&#8217;ve written and talked about this endlessly elsewhere, and I&#8217;m not going to repeat myself here.</p>
<p>Anyway, I had to step in and correct that massive overstatement.</p>
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